Base Raiding - Your Input Please

[Tim]

@Creighton Goodwin
That's a good point, we'll have to do some testing with bullet damage. But like I said, the difference between using explosive damage over bullet damage will be night and day. It just wont make sense to even spray the base with bullets.

 

[Creighton Goodwin]

@Creighton Goodwin
That's a good point, we'll have to do some testing with bullet damage. But like I said, the difference between using explosive damage over bullet damage will be night and day. It just wont make sense to even spray the base with bullets.

Ah, I was thinking it'd be a similar system to the one you used on DarkDM when you could reasonably destroy bases using an M249 or AWP. If the damage from bullets on props is so little, then it's a non issue. Then another way to combat the prop stacking issue would perhaps make the plasma cutter an AOE tool. You would still need to get close to the prop and you'd need to hold it while it works, but it would effect a small cone of props.



Effect could also be modeled by effecting props linearly for 1 meter (or whatever distance you want) in the direction of the players eyes.

EDIT: An idea in connection to this might be to create a few jobs. A handyman job who has the tool that is used to repair blocks. They can only be repaired by this class or the Elite version of the class who has the repair tool, plasma cutter, and is allowed to raid (not solo raid) for pay or with their gang, similar to how the medic and combat medic classes worked. Just a thought.

 

[Hammy Hobo]

Ah, I was thinking it'd be a similar system to the one you used on DarkDM when you could reasonably destroy bases using an M249 or AWP. If the damage from bullets on props is so little, then it's a non issue. Then another way to combat the prop stacking issue would perhaps make the plasma cutter an AOE tool. You would still need to get close to the prop and you'd need to hold it while it works, but it would effect a small cone of props.

-snip-

Effect could also be modeled by effecting props linearly for 1 meter (or whatever distance you want) in the direction of the players eyes.

EDIT: An idea in connection to this might be to create a few jobs. A handyman job who has the tool that is used to repair blocks. They can only be repaired by this class or the Elite version of the class who has the repair tool, plasma cutter, and is allowed to raid (not solo raid) for pay or with their gang, similar to how the medic and combat medic classes worked. Just a thought.

I kinda like the way that would work, with the Plasma Cutter. It would stop people from just prop stacking to make Plasma Cutter useless, just like the Ghoster.

 

[Levande]

i like prop damage

 

[LTK]

What if it wasn't all props but selected props to ghost?

 

[Creighton Goodwin]

What if it wasn't all props but selected props to ghost?

I dont quite get what you mean. Could you elaborate?

 

[LTK]

I dont quite get what you mean. Could you elaborate?

actually nvm

 

[Tim]

Ah, I was thinking it'd be a similar system to the one you used on DarkDM when you could reasonably destroy bases using an M249 or AWP. If the damage from bullets on props is so little, then it's a non issue. Then another way to combat the prop stacking issue would perhaps make the plasma cutter an AOE tool. You would still need to get close to the prop and you'd need to hold it while it works, but it would effect a small cone of props.

View attachment 1

Effect could also be modeled by effecting props linearly for 1 meter (or whatever distance you want) in the direction of the players eyes.

EDIT: An idea in connection to this might be to create a few jobs. A handyman job who has the tool that is used to repair blocks. They can only be repaired by this class or the Elite version of the class who has the repair tool, plasma cutter, and is allowed to raid (not solo raid) for pay or with their gang, similar to how the medic and combat medic classes worked. Just a thought.

This is what I have it mind. I think we have enough information to get something started and see how it goes. No promises if it'll be included on launch.

 

[Sir Ryan]

Here are some thoughts on the prop damage system... just thoughts.

Prop Damage
So same end result as above, but different approach. With this system, every whitelisted building prop has a health value assigned to it depending on its material and size. We would assign this manually. Shooting a prop with bullets will take its health down slowly, while explosives take it down fast. Once the props health reaches 0%, it'll go transparent and collisions will be disabled, allowing you to walk through it. To repair it, pull out the repair wrench and wack it. Players should now be able to build something more aesthetically pleasing, but with thicker walls.

This might be problematic, especially if there are minges online. Explosive damage is a good idea (possibly using weapons like C4 and Grenades), but I do not think bullet damage is a good idea, because of how easily it can be abused. C4, Grenades, etc. should be able to be purchased through a black market dealer or a heavy arms dealer.

 

[Tim]

Here are some thoughts on the prop damage system... just thoughts.


This might be problematic, especially if there are minges online. Explosive damage is a good idea (possibly using weapons like C4 and Grenades), but I do not think bullet damage is a good idea, because of how easily it can be abused. C4, Grenades, etc. should be able to be purchased through a black market dealer or a heavy arms dealer.

That's basically how it'll be.

 

[LTK]

That's basically how it'll be.

I think the only thing that should affect towards prop damage is C4 and projectile explosions. Grenades shouldn't account for that.

 

[Sir Ryan]

I think the only thing that should affect towards prop damage is C4 and projectile explosions. Grenades shouldn't account for that.

Thats a good idea. Base raiding needs to have more risk for the raiding team. Imo C4 should only be sold in shipments for $100,000+.
This is also good for prevent abuse/minging.

 

[Shade]

I agree that raiding should not be impossible, however prop destruction completly ruins base building. There will only be two types of bases: Those which use unrealistic building to make breaking/ghosting props useless, and those which are very easy to raid. Then only people who figure out how to negate prop destruction through weird tricks will have defendable bases.

ADVERTS
I noticed in the rules that you have to advert raid. This is something that I think is a mistake. It is not realistic and it really hurts raiding. Stealth/surprise should be a tactic that can be used.

 

[Jack Nigs]

Here are some thoughts on the prop damage system... just thoughts.


This might be problematic, especially if there are minges online. Explosive damage is a good idea (possibly using weapons like C4 and Grenades), but I do not think bullet damage is a good idea, because of how easily it can be abused. C4, Grenades, etc. should be able to be purchased through a black market dealer or a heavy arms dealer.

As someone who enjoys building bases on DarkRP servers a lot, this is extremely problematic. I believe if you are raiding someones base - without prior knowledge to anything inside the actual base (aka the layout of it) - you should have to struggle a little in order to get in. The idea of giving props health and allowing explosives that can easily kill multiple people in the first place, let alone guns, do damage to props essentially ruins base building.

Back on old tdrp I thought the Ghoster and the Super Ghoster were pretty good raiding tools. Hell look at the "Ghoster" the police have, if you have no forewarning of them coming you are boned, they are coming in your base and you don't really have defense if you can't react quick enough. Not just this, the only people who benefit from this type of update would be donators who get a higher prop limit, and the people who have all the money that can afford big raiding tools. With the current rules, as long as they are followed, I don't foresee many issues with raiding.

Not just this, imagine you're the new person trying to get into playing on tdrp. You got a pistol chillin in your base with a starter printer that takes 15 mins to break even with. Now, not only do you have no money, you also are relatively defenseless. Next thing you know you have people blowing up/shooting your props and you're dead because apparently, people can rip through props. Are you staying on that server after that just happened or are you getting onto a different one?

Now, I understand realism should be taken into account but you wanna have fun and play the game. Not get shit on 24/7

Tl;dr - Raiding shouldn't be a "1v1 open ground" situation, you're breaking into someone base. You should have to struggle, if you want to make it easier just add better raiding tools, not game/rp-breaking mechanics

 

[Leaky_Chumbucket]

In order to create a more healthy and streamlined raiding experience, I believe that 2 or more admins must be present during a raid session. This would not only help the case of revenge RDM ,it would also ensure that each side wouldn't be cheating nor trying anything suspicious. RP servers are known for people trying to manipulate the gameplay in anyway that they can so they can get the edge. Admins being present would solve this issue in a professional manner and with the help of TimTheFunnyMan, raiding would be balanced and feel more fleshed out.

Also to combat the issue of players not being able to defend themselves in a raid, We should also look into adding a cap. This cap would help out players in need to defend themselves. The cap in essence, would prevent players from raiding another players base unless they reach the cap of the necessary players needed to raid a base. So for example, If I had a base with 3 other friends, you could only raid my base if you had 6 or more players on your group/gang/party.

These changes would create an effective solution to the problem that is plaguing all DarkRP servers. Tim has been asking for years, Why has raiding been such an unfun experience. We tried to balance the raiding by getting rid of the old RPG. Then he tried to add a new RPG that would no collide map props. This guy has been trying his damn hardest to make the server a more enjoyable server for the masses.





-Leaky_Chumbucket (in case you forgot my name. add me on steam!)

 

[SteveFromAccounting]

In order to create a more healthy and streamlined raiding experience, I believe that 2 or more admins must be present during a raid session. This would not only help the case of revenge RDM ,it would also ensure that each side wouldn't be cheating nor trying anything suspicious. RP servers are known for people trying to manipulate the gameplay in anyway that they can so they can get the edge. Admins being present would solve this issue in a professional manner and with the help of TimTheFunnyMan, raiding would be balanced and feel more fleshed out.

Also to combat the issue of players not being able to defend themselves in a raid, We should also look into adding a cap. This cap would help out players in need to defend themselves. The cap in essence, would prevent players from raiding another players base unless they reach the cap of the necessary players needed to raid a base. So for example, If I had a base with 3 other friends, you could only raid my base if you had 6 or more players on your group/gang/party.

These changes would create an effective solution to the problem that is plaguing all DarkRP servers. Tim has been asking for years, Why has raiding been such an unfun experience. We tried to balance the raiding by getting rid of the old RPG. Then he tried to add a new RPG that would no collide map props. This guy has been trying his damn hardest to make the server a more enjoyable server for the masses.





-Leaky_Chumbucket (in case you forgot my name. add me on steam!)

Those are terrible ideas, Admins would only be in the way, not to mention an actual waste of their time. If they really wanted to watch the raid they could with spectate. However having an admin on or even present in order to raid would kill the server and no one would want to go through so much bullshit just to raid, it's already a pain in the ass to have to advert the raids. Having raid caps is also retarded, if we can fit 2,000 jews in a gas chamber i should be able to liberate them by myself commando style.

 

[Leaky_Chumbucket]

Those are terrible ideas, Admins would only be in the way, not to mention an actual waste of their time. If they really wanted to watch the raid they could with spectate. However having an admin on or even present in order to raid would kill the server and no one would want to go through so much bullshit just to raid, it's already a pain in the ass to have to advert the raids. Having raid caps is also retarded, if we can fit 2,000 jews in a gas chamber i should be able to liberate them by myself commando style.

I dont think your getting the idea that Im suggesting ideas that would create a more streamlined gameplay. With the implementation of the cap, there would be no need for an advert. As soon as you have enough people to raid, there would be a text that would immediately come up for the person being raided so that they at least know. But no longer would the raiders need to advert the message. They would be able to just gather their teams and be able to raid immediately. Or we would get Tim to be present during raids.

Also having admins being present for a raid would be a great idea because all they would do would be to watch the raid occur. They don't need to do anything so long as players are respecting the rules while they raid. Admins being present would not be a waste of their time bc they would be able to put someone in an immediate sit once an inappropriate action.

 

[KoalaOverlord]

Also having admins being present for a raid would be a great idea because all they would do would be to watch the raid occur. They don't need to do anything so long as players are respecting the rules while they raid. Admins being present would not be a waste of their time bc they would be able to put someone in an immediate sit once an inappropriate action

That is incredibly unneeded and overkill. With as many sits that happen now and player:admin ratio, it would not be very probable or even logical to have an admin spectate every single raid.

 

[SteveFromAccounting]

I dont think your getting the idea that Im suggesting ideas that would create a more streamlined gameplay. With the implementation of the cap, there would be no need for an advert. As soon as you have enough people to raid, there would be a text that would immediately come up for the person being raided so that they at least know. But no longer would the raiders need to advert the message. They would be able to just gather their teams and be able to raid immediately. Or we would get Tim to be present during raids.

Also having admins being present for a raid would be a great idea because all they would do would be to watch the raid occur. They don't need to do anything so long as players are respecting the rules while they raid. Admins being present would not be a waste of their time bc they would be able to put someone in an immediate sit once an inappropriate action.

You're not being realistic about any of this. First off making an entire script (we don't even have anyone to code for us) for raiding would be broken as fuck and wouldn't be used. Having admins hanging around every raid as a requirement to raid would be taking up time that they could be using to stop other forms of abuse (RDM,RDA,Prop spam, harassment) never mind having Tim of all people to watch the raids. If Tim was around for every raid he'd just spawn in guns and bomb the fuck out of the base as he usually does when Tim runs around. I think you're being way to unrealistic and not actually taking anything else into account.